[Interview] Showrunner D.J. MacHale Dishes About Are You Afraid of the Dark?!

HERE’S WHAT HAPPENED

While writing these Are You Afraid of the Dark? reviews, we sometimes joked to each other, “We should totally ask D.J. MacHale about that.” D.J. was the co-creator and showrunner of the series, meaning he wrote and directed various episodes, but also script edited and produced the entirety of the original ninety-one episodes.

After touching on his work in our season one recap, we reached out to D.J. and he was generous enough to answer our questions.

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THE INTERVIEW

1. Television in the ’90s was even less diverse than today, but Are You Afraid of the Dark? routinely featured people of color. At a time when the one black guy on Saved by the Bell: The New Class only showed interest in black girls, AYAOTD? had multiple episodes featuring interracial pairings. Was this a conscious effort, or blind casting?

It was a little of both.  There was a definite effort to be diverse.  It was a mantra for my partner Ned and I, but I will also give a lot of credit to Nickelodeon.  They constantly kept our feet to the fire to cast people of color.  It wasn't always easy, only because the vast majority of actors who auditioned were white. One thing I'm very proud of, is that when it came right down to putting any particular actor in a role, we were color blind. Unless we had to cobble together a family where it would make sense that they all presented as the same ethnicity, we didn't let color influence our choices.  We had interracial couples from the get-go in season #1.  If I remember, there may have been a minute where we said:  "Are we going to get flak for this?"  But the immediate conclusion was:  "Maybe. So what?"  I'm also proud that we were nominated for an NAACP award for diversity.

2. We love that Kiki’s stories usually feature black characters. Can you tell us a little about how that came to be?

If I remember my thought process correctly, the thinking was that if somebody was imagining characters that they had created, which is what The Midnight Society did, then chances are those characters would look something like the person who made them up.  In hindsight, that may be a bit less "color blind" than I'd like, but it did seem to make logical sense.  I'm not so sure we held true to that rule through all 91 episodes.

3. Kiki and Sardo are both queer coded. Sardo in particular is a fantastic example of how to have a campy character who isn’t offensive. Were you aware at the time that Kiki and Sardo were reading as queer?

Not at first. I don't know if I should be embarrassed for being clueless, or proud for being legit color (or in this case queer) blind.  I created Sardo...at least on the page, but I didn't direct the episode where he first appeared, and his character was set.  Though I did cast the actor, it was that actor and the director who worked to create Sardo's performance, and mannerisms.  (In other words, he wasn't written as being "queer", at least not that I was aware of)  I loved the performance from the get-go, so much so that I made him a continuing character. It wasn't until about season #4 when a friend of mine who worked on the show, who happens to be gay, made a comment to me about Sardo being gay. 

I was like:  "Huh?  You think so?"  His response was to laugh as if to say:  "Are you blind?"   As for Kiki, I wasn't thinking "gueer" when I created the character.  (And in this case, I DID direct her)  I was thinking tomboy...as a way to work against "girl" stereotypes and also to contrast her with the true "girly-girl" in The Midnight Society, Kristen.  So again, diversity.  But it wasn't until I read your question that I even thought about it.  Again...am I clueless or evolved?  Maybe both.  I like to think that I create interesting characters, and people can perceive them any way they'd like.

4. One of our favorite episodes is “The Tale of the Captured Souls” and it happens to be one of the queerest. Danny rebels against feminine stereotypes and has a strange relationship with Peter, who’s somewhat effeminate. How much of this would you say was intentional? And what was the inspiration for the episode? The Picture of Dorian Gray or something else?

The inspiration for the episode was definitely Dorian Gray.  In the early stages of the show, Nickelodeon asked me to use "literary antecedents" as the jumping off point for stories.  Their thinking was that if parents complained to them about the show, their comeback would be:  "What are you talking about?  This is classic literature!"  It was probably why they chose: "The Tale of the Twisted Claw" to be the pilot episode.  I had written four scripts, and that was the one they wanted us to shoot, probably because it had a literary antecedent: "The Monkey's Paw".  In hindsight that argument probably wouldn't have placated an irate parent. More importantly, there weren't any irate parents.  So it was a wasted exercise. 

As for the characters of Danny and Peter being queer, that wasn't intentional.  Danny is pretty much an alter-ego of Kiki, since Kiki told the story.  (so if Kiki reads queer, then I guess Danny would too) I directed that episode and did something that I thought I'd get flak for, but it made total sense in the context of the story. The premise was that Danny and her family were aging rapidly. It was easy enough to age her parents...we grayed them up and slowed them down. But when you rapidly age an 11 year old, the first thing they hit is puberty.  So in the script, I had her get acne.  But in the moments where she's realizing that she's aging, I had her look down her shirt and react to the fact that she was suddenly getting breasts.  That wasn't in the script.  It's both a spooky and funny moment that I don't think you could get away with today.

As for Peter, I wasn't going for anything other than "something's up with this guy".  I mean, here's a guy who is literally sucking the life out of people who come to his B&B.  The actor who played Peter was terrific. In his audition, he read the part pretty much the same way he ultimately performed it.  As soon as I saw him audition I said:  "That's it!"  So it was the actor who defined the part as much as the script.

5.  Were there any one-off characters or tales that you considered to be LGBT? We'd love to have any insights while we continue our re-watch.

It's hard to remember them all.  91 episodes is a lot of episodes.  One does spring to mind, and if I'm not mistaken it was the way this character was originally depicted in the "literary antecedent".  It's the character of Ichabod Crane in "The Tale of the Midnight Ride".  I do believe that in The Legend of Sleepy Hollow that Crane was depicted as somewhat effete, so that's what I went for in this episode.  Was he queer?  Beats me.

6. We were surprised to learn you wrote episodes as "Chloe Brown." What was the reason behind that?

That's a very long story, but the bottom line was that the Canadian Producer didn't want my name all over the show...even though it should have been.

7. Were any of the Midnight Society members, or the dynamics between them, inspired by friends you had as a teen?

All of the characters I've created are an amalgam of people I've known...including myself.  I rarely take the characteristics of someone I know and make them a complete fictional character, except maybe with truly minor characters who only play a small role.  All of my characters are more like the Frankenstein monster, having been stitched together using multiple real people. The classic advice to any writer is "write what you know".  So in order to create believable characters, you have to write about people you know.

8. Every time a member of the Midnight Society left, it was explained that they moved away, but there was no reason given for Eric’s departure. Was it a failed coup that resulted in Gary expelling him, or some other scandal?

Hah, no.  If I had known then what I know now, I would have addressed his departure.  (Even if it was something as lame as:  "Kristen and David's parents moved away")  But at the time, I didn't think that people would care.  Or even notice.  LIttle did I know that The Midnight Society would become such a "thing".  To me, the real value of the episodes were the tales.  The Midnight Society was just the device to set them up.   Back in those days, there was no social media.  Fans didn't have forums to express their opinions. Today, it amazes me when I read people making comments  about how they thought episodes were good or bad, based on the make up of The Midnight Society!  But I guess it makes some sense because The Midnight Society was the only true continuity in this anthology show.

So in hindsight, I should have addressed it.  I'll make something up now.  Eric got booted, the victim of his own snark.

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OUR REACTION

Troy: This was so cool. We joke around and have fun with how we watch the show, but D.J. gave me a feeling of validation that some aspects were intentional and others were happy accidents. I didn’t need that to enjoy the show the way I do, but it’s nice to know the diversity that we pick up on was there from the top down.

Erin: Yes, totally. I LOVE how straightforward and thoughtful he is. When you’re a kid, you rarely think about where the content you consume comes from. It just exists. But as a grown up and a writer, I now have a much deeper appreciation for storytellers and creators, and getting the chance to pick the brain of someone who created something that was an integral part of my tweenhood is just amazing. It was obviously a passion project for him and he had zero interest in “dumbing it down” because it was for kids. I’d like to imagine that tween-me was drawn to AYAOYD? in part because I could sense it was a thoughtful passion project and not a piece of corporate dreck or moralistic fuckery.

T: It’ll be interesting when we get to “The Tale of the Midnight Ride” to see how queer Ichabod Crane reads knowing that he sprang to D.J.’s mind. That’ll be the season three premiere.

E: Squeeeeeeee! Can’t wait.

T: We got breaking news! Fans have been wondering since 1991 what happened to Eric, and now we know he was excommunicated for too much snark. How do you think that meeting of the Midnight Society went down?

E: You just know Kristin cried over her conflicted feelings. “He’s such a twerp but do we have to be so meeeeeeeean?” *sob*

Thanks again to D.J. MacHale for his time. You can check out more about his many projects and find a list of some other AYAOTD? interviews he’s done over the years at djmachalebooks.com.